Estimates

Bidding on a project without a shot list means you cannot know the exact costs for expenses, and you will be concepting the creative shot list. When you are wearing more hats, you need to charge for your time and call it a CREATIVE CONCEPTING FEE.

When bidding on a job,  you are in the position to make an educated decision to be the “bank” running all the costs through your own company vs having it go through the producer.  Any markup or differences in actual prices will be a profit to whoever gets paid for the job. This can be you if you want to handle your billing. The decision is yours.

When you’re asked to bid on a job and choose a producer to work with, it’s important to make an educated decision about billing. Many producers handle all the costs and serve as the financial intermediary, and this is also common among reps. However, this isn’t how I operate, so I can’t speak from that perspective.

You need to decide whether you want the money to go through your name, directly through the producer, or through the rep. This decision should be made and clarified beforehand. If you choose to handle billing yourself, keep in mind that there could be a markup and leftover money from production expenses that could potentially benefit the producer.

Some photographers prefer to manage their own billing to avoid the markup and keep more of the budget, but this might limit your opportunities to work with certain producers. It’s worth considering how many producers would be willing to work under these terms. Ultimately, it’s your decision and you should carefully weigh your options.

Q:

Hi Andrea! I have a question regarding one-sheets that maybe might be helpful for the community. Would you suggest including a project minimum? I’ve been getting a lot of requests for “rate cards” and I usually say it’s project dependent.

A:

Photographer’s rates depend on the type of work you do. If you can simplify this request with a rate card, it would save you time. My goal as the agent is to save time by quickly finding out if we should continue this conversation by quoting a price range. I’ll say, “Our day rate fee for this would usually be somewhere between 4,000 – 10,000, depending on many factors like shot count, shot list, day count, the creative component of the images, and what the licensed usage rights are. What is your budget?” I find a price range to be the fastest way to get to the next step.

Q:

Hello! I have a question. My producer and I did a major bid for the product launch using many models, it involved a huge production of set building, and various teams for what they asked for. We ended up not getting the project, it was nothing that was asked of us as far as production, sets and look. Is there a way to approach the agency when bidding that allows us to be bidding the same job – apples for apples?

A:

While we can’t predict or control the bidding process, we can ask every question to help us understand the production details. The key is to have an A+ producer and make sure you get on a creative call, as that is where we get our answers. The purpose of three-way bidding is to protect clients in a fair apple to apple comparison, so they are not overpaying. Our goal is to protect ourselves by understanding all the information, even when we may have to dig around to get that info.

Clients don’t always have all the facts when we are bidding a job, leading us to under-bid certain areas. If more responsibility falls into your lap than expected, don’t hold back in stating your case to request more $. Clients know that some gray areas may result in an overage, but they need us to be the ones to ask for it.

Sometimes we bid on projects where we don’t have all the information yet, and the client may not have all the details either, leading to many assumptions. We should include “TBD” (to be determined) on those line items in our bid to protect ourselves. Even if we don’t include them, once the job is awarded and more responsibilities shift to us that were initially thought to be handled by the client, don’t hesitate to ask for additional funds. Address any new needs or changes directly with the client—don’t get frustrated. Often, they will understand because the situation was unknown at the time. Request more prep days, additional tech scout days if needed, extra post time, or anything else necessary. Remember, just because the bid is awarded doesn’t mean you have to absorb these changes without discussing them.

Q:

Hey there, I had a meeting today with a client that I would really like to work with. The meeting went great but they asked what my test rate is and I’m kind of at a loss. Any suggestions on pricing a test would be greatly appreciated.

A:

A test rate usually falls within half of what the regular day rate can be for a client. The logic behind the test rate is how it does not include usage licensing fees. This principle is the same premise for how I price a pre-light day; always have the estimate read, “no usage included” next to this fee.

Make an educated choice when choosing a producer to help you bid a job. Be aware that some charge a 10% production fee on the expenses and some don’t.  Some do waive that fee if you ask, so know that you do have options.

When you are bidding for a job you have to ask yourself if you need a producer and if so, which producer do you need? There’s a new element to our decision, it’s called a production fee. It used to be called a markup fee and then ad agencies did not want to pay that fee. Now it’s called a production fee. What we’re paying for is 10% of the production expenses that gets paid to the producer. They want to be covered for giving their employees health insurance and other expenses to keep their business going. It’s a new concept and some producers don’t charge it, but some do. Think about that and ask that question when you are choosing your producer.

Q:

How do you charge differently in one case where a client comes to your with a project that is 90% fleshed out and you fill in the remaining 10% vs. a client that comes with a project that is 10% fleshed out and you come up with the other 90%… on a sliding scale you become art director and photographer… is that something that gets accounted for in the final bid?

A:

In my experience, the clients who don’t hire an art director or designer are trying to save money. They have lower budgets, so they want the photographer to come up with the branded shot list. I suggest staying clear of these situations because you are doing someone else’s job without getting paid for it. I’ve never seen these types of clients agree to pay more for art directing, but they really should. The first question I always ask is, “what is your shot list?”

When a client handles production expenses and asks for your day-rate estimate, be careful as they often assume that will include other costs such as your crew, camera gear, and retouching. Spelling that out on your estimate is not enough. Before the job happens, ask how they are handling the specific production costs that pertain to you. 

Something often happens with estimates, especially when it’s from client direct. They are handling the production expenses. They ask us for a bid or an estimate just for our fees but it’s often not just our fees. They think other things are inclusive with fees. When fees are really your usage and your time, your creative fee, your day rate. Even after you think they understand because you’ve made it very clear, do it again. Make sure before the job happens that they are crystal clear if more retouching is needed or if overtime happens it’s going to be this much. Ask them how they are handling the crew, how they want to handle your equipment. Stuff like that. Assume they don’t know because you have to protect yourself even if you think you already did in the estimate.

Overtime is tricky because even if you think the client will be expecting it, don’t take any chances. They hired you as the director, controlling the day, offering strategic steps to look out for their best interest. Bring it up before it’s too late.

We have to talk about overtime. If you’re on a job and you see yourself heading towards overtime, talk with the client. Check in with yourself at lunch time, or early in the day. Ask yourself, “Where are we?” Are you falling beyond or you’re not getting all the shots done in the 10 hours. Overtime was probably already discussed with the client in an email and it’s on your contract or even talked about on the phone, but don’t count on that. Talk to them or have your producer talk for you or your rep. The client has to know in advance because they might not have the budget and it’s your responsibility. Even if they’re trying to add shots and you’ve said ok. Also, the amount of overtime has to be approved, such as how many hours of overtime and for how many people. You don’t want any surprises and you never want to hand it to your client and say, “Surprise!” You have to protect yourself.